[etoys-dev] Etoys developer chat log

Derek O'Connell doc at doconnel.f9.co.uk
Thu Jun 10 05:18:20 EDT 2010

Sorry I missed this weeks mtg. I hope to put spend some more time on 
WebCamMorph this weekend...

> * also camera support hopefully, need to simplify interface

> <bertf>  karlram: the current one has too many controls. we should put in just the bare minimum and then see what people find missing
> <bertf>  but having camera support on all platforms would be awesome
> <karlram>  Sounds good
> <karlram>  Many of the controls are a bit hard to understand :-)

Last weekend I added help text to both the SqueakSource wiki and in the 
class comments. If these are not enough then let me know.

WebCamMorph started off as a simple demo of how to use CameraPlugin 
class and any further development was really just me satisfying my own 
curiosity. If it does not satisfy Etoys educational needs then feel free 
to chop it up as you see fit. Alternatively give me a clear idea of just 
how simple you want it and I will see what I can do. The simplest 
version I can think of is no control over resolution/fps/etc and just a 
single "capture" command (including display update). To me this seems 
too simply though because we are dealing with a video camera and not a 
common digital camera used to take snapshots. The two have different 
purposes and work differently as a consequence and the current controls 
in WebCamMorph are simply a reflection of that.


On 07/06/10 21:26, Bert Freudenberg wrote:
> We had a chat again:
> * Etoys will follow the Sugar release schedule:
>    http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/0.90/Roadmap
> * should prepare a first alpha release in June, with translations and DrGeo for wider testing
> * also camera support hopefully, need to simplify interface
> * there is a decompiler problem, possibly because of Eliot's changes
> * multi-touch working pretty well on iPad now
> * need idea about how to debug missing mouse-overs
> Full log below, as usual. And see you next Monday, same time:
> 	http://tinyurl.com/2bjpzbe
> - Bert -
> <bertf>  hi karl
> <karlram>  hi
> <karlram>  not maye here
> <karlram>  many
> <bertf>  yep
> <bertf>  busy, hopefully ;)
> <karlram>  he he
> <karlram>  I had some issues with a ehancement I integrated
> <karlram>  enhancement
> <bertf>  the broken viewers?
> -->  hilaire (~hilaire at bon74-1-88-184-136-97.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #etoys
> <bertf>  ah, hi hilaire :)
> <karlram>  jup , it added all sort of stuff to variables categorie
> <hilaire>  hello
> <karlram>  hi
> <bertf>  do you think it's okay now?
> <karlram>  It was a one line fix
> <bertf>  good
> <bertf>  hilaire: thanks for submitting dr geo :)
> <karlram>  But images must get past the bad fix without opening a viewer....
> <bertf>  I wouldn't worry too much abouht that
> <karlram>  Ok
> <bertf>  we're just a handful people updating regularly  I think
> <karlram>  you are right
> <bertf>  do we need a do-it to fix it, if someone loaded the broken version?
> <karlram>  I had another issue
> <karlram>  deleting a etoy variable seems broken
> <karlram>  when  the variable is part of a etoy script
> <bertf>  hmm. that should be a blocker ticket
> <bertf>  just so it is not forgotten
> <bertf>  you mean when the var is already used in a script?
> <karlram>  I'll add it, the Decompiler complains about some issues
> <bertf>  ah. might have to do with eliots changes then
> <karlram>  Should I notify Eliot ?
> <bertf>  wouldn't hurt
> <karlram>  Ok
> <bertf>  in any case, we should commit to a release schedule. I think adopting the Sugar one makes sense
> <karlram>  and sugar release is ?
> <bertf>  a July release would be too rushed
> <bertf>  I sent mail about that, give me a second to find it
> <bertf>  http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/0.90/Roadmap
> <karlram>  July seems very close
> <bertf>  right. september sounds sensible
> <bertf>  we still should try to get an alpha release out asap
> <bertf>  including dr geo and the new translations
> <bertf>  so more people can test that stuff
> <karlram>  Sound good
> <karlram>  dr geo is big , in many ways
> <karlram>  :-)
> <karlram>  a huge framework
> <karlram>  and lots of classes
> <karlram>  and lot and lots of new stuff to learn :-)
> <bertf>  indeed
> <bertf>  but if we can get the fonts out of the image, we still will have a smaller image even with dr geo included
> <bertf>  richo started on that
> <bertf>  he pushed Andreas' font loader code
> <bertf>  maybe we should start freezign features a bit earlier than the Sugar schedule ...
> <bertf>  hilaire: did you want to talk about somethign specifically?
> <karlram>  what about the camera morph stuff ?
> <karlram>  wait another release to mature?
> <hilaire>  bertf: no
> <bertf>  karlram: no I think it would be a nice feature to have
> <bertf>  karlram: but I would start simple
> <bertf>  hilaire: okay. thanks for stopping by :)
> <bertf>  karlram: the current one has too many controls. we should put in just the bare minimum and then see what people find missing
> <bertf>  but having camera support on all platforms would be awesome
> <karlram>  Sounds good
> <karlram>  Many of the controls are a bit hard to understand :-)
> <bertf>  yeah
> <hilaire>  I need to rest
> <hilaire>  bye
> <karlram>  ye
> <karlram>  bye
> <hilaire>  add a hard time with students today..
> <-- hilaire (~hilaire at bon74-1-88-184-136-97.fbx.proxad.net) has left #etoys
> <karlram>  Students are not always what you want them to be :-)
> <karlram>  I sent a mail to Eliot about http://tracker.squeakland.org/browse/SQ-710
> <bertf>  thanks
> <bertf>  I got multitouch workign this weekend :)
> <bertf>  on the iPad
> <bertf>  you can draw with more than one finger, or move multiple objects at once
> <bertf>  pretty cool
> <bertf>  now if you also could rotate and scale them with two fingers that would be awesome :)
> <karlram>  Oh, sound cool
> <bertf>  And now that I compiled the VM with enabled optimizations it's even quite usable ;)
> <karlram>  I remember some issues with mouse over states from earlier touch based computers
> <bertf>  I was using it without optimizations for like two weeks .. was rather slow
> <bertf>  yes, some things rely on mouse overs
> <bertf>  e.g. the color selector in the paint box
> <bertf>  I'd have thought it goes away on mouse-up, but apparently noe
> <bertf>  not
> <bertf>  hmm. your Etoys-kfr.19 looks identical ...
> <karlram>  I was fighting mouse over issue with SelectionMourh, very annoying....
> <bertf>  but there is no diff
> <bertf>  no changes
> <karlram>  Hm, very weird, my image had the wrong method still displaying...
> <karlram>  I got confuced...
> <karlram>  confused
> <karlram>  lol
> <bertf>  always check changes before committing
> <karlram>  I know
> <karlram>  Back to the mouse over issues, do you  know a good way to debug them ?
> <bertf>  I'd simulate at touch event
> <bertf>  that is, filter out all mousemove events that have button=0
> <bertf>  so you only get mouse down, move, and up, but no moves after mouse up
> <bertf>  that should recreate the problem  on a normal machine
> <karlram>  ok
> <karlram>  ipad is not a very fast machine ?
> <bertf>  karlram: it feels very fast
> <bertf>  just not in etoys
> <bertf>  for Etoys it's about the XO-1 speed I would say
> <bertf>  so not great but usable
> <bertf>  okay, thanks for chatting, I'll send the log as usual :)_______________________________________________
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